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Grant was one of the hottest coaches available when we hired him. We paid market value for him.
Coaches salaries are increasing. If you want a good coach you are going to have to pay for him. You also have to pay him enough that another program doesn't try to hire him away. We are not a destination job. If you low ball a coach, you're probably not gonna get him to sign the contract.
Mark Gottfried makes 1.95. Frank Martin makes 1.9. 1.9 mill wasn't enough to hey Greg Marshall to NC State. Basketball salaries are on the rise...
Gottfried got a raise this year to over 1.9. Grant got his 4 yrs. ago, and yes he was the hot name, but of everyone on the list of Top 20 salaries, Grant is the only one to have never produced a single thing since making that salary. His major accomplishment is winning a league title at VCU and beating the worst Duke team in 20 years. VCU was a winner before he got there, and got a ton better after he left. You are measured by the Tourney. Being 2nd place in a bad league isnt what we pay for. Also Gottfried got a raise after taking a team to the sweet 16. We gave Grant a raise for losing in the 1st round of the tourney, and if you say well he deserved it for getting us there. Then please tell me what we pay him for? Also 1.9 was enough for Marshall, a lot of coaches were scared of the NC State job because of Duke and UNC. Fact is he has made 7.6 million from us, not including assistant salaries and hasn't given us one NCAA victory. Is that so much to ask?
One more thing on Marshall and Martin. Martin has had multiple NCAA victories in the last 6 yrs. Also I am not as big as a Marshall fan as other people on here. He does consistently get his team from an easier league into the NCAA tourney. However in 15 yrs. of coaching, and 8 NCAA trips he has only amassed one NCAA Victory as well.
??? Nine of those seasons were at Winthrop. You make it to the tournament from the big south and you play a one or two seed. He barely lost to a Gonzaga squad led by Morrison. He beat Notre Dame and he was beat on a ridiculous shot by Chris Lofton.
He needed to rebuild at Wichita State. Now he is about to go on a serious run unless he gets hired away. I think Marshall can be an elite coach. He plays the recruiting game and he develops talent.
Does the fact that we potentially have to overpay a coach in order to get him to bama come in to play in the salary discussion?
My guess is that is the story for most of the sec basketball coaches and from the looks of things nearly all of them are grossly overpaid.
So, is there any chance we make a change this year or are we stuck in mediocrity for several more years?
I have no doubt that with Grant at the helm we will be in the NCAA tournament 1 out of every 2-3 years and a staple in the NIT. His style of play is boring and he doesn't personally try to go out and develop the program by boosting fan support. At least with CMG, we weren't paying a ridiculous amount of money and we were consistently in the top 25. Heck, the guy even took us to an Elite 8. Certainly he underperformed, but what Grant has done in his 4 years has been equally underwhelming. I just think it is sad that the AD will allow a basketball program to be mired in mediocrity when we could easily go out with the funds we have available and make this program a mainstay in the NCAA tournament.
If hiring CNS has taught us anything, it is that going out and throwing big money at a coach will more than pay for itself. If I was AD (and I want no part of that job), I'd go out and throw huge money at a PROVEN winner. Grant should have taught us that throwing money at a dude at a mid-major is usually a mistake (see: Billie Gillespie and the 100 other coaches who have failed at a bigger stage). My short list would be Mark Few, Brad Stevens, or Bo Ryan. Yeah, yeah, I know that Few and Stevens only have basketball at their school so it is a big deal, our facilities suck, etc... but throw $3 million per year with the possibility for more into the contract and see what they say. Give them control of the program and try to budget in money for facility upgrades. IF you want to build a winner and take your program to heights it has never been to before, that is how you do it. And for God's sake, get the students around the court and out of the corner.
OR, we can stick with who we have now and consistently be on the NCAA bubble, in the NIT more than the NCAA, and scoring 50 points per game while only half-filling Coleman.
This post was edited by Saban14 14 months ago
Stevens, Few, and Bo Ryan???? I hope you have a "B" list. That is one problem that I have with making a change, who are we going to get? Comparing it to football and throwing money at a top coach (i.e CNS) is not a fair comparison. Alabama is arguably the most prestigious job in college football. Basketball we are not. And don't give me the "back in the day under Wimp" line. We were a very good solid program then, but we still have never made a Final 4 or sniffed anything more than some sweet 16's and CMG's magical elite 8 run.
This post was edited by UAgrad09 14 months ago
Grant isn't going anywhere. Next year will be better because of depth in the paint. Next year we will be a tournament team. We will have a senior at point guard. Lacey, Randolph, Cooper, and Pollard will be back to their normal positions. Also, we will have a five man rotation in the paint. That in and of itself will make a huge difference.
Where do you get this consistently in the top 25 under Gottfried? That just didn't happen. He only had three winning seasons in SEC, and over the course of his career he may have won 12-15 SEC road games. We were not consistently in the top 25. He only finished the season in the top 25 twice during his tenure at Alabama. And while I thoroughly enjoyed the Elite 8 run, that Alabama team had to finish the season with a damn near ten game winning streak to get in the tournament. Gottfried had some huge highs but they were swallowed up by numerous blow outs on the road, bad losses to teams they should have destroyed, the inability to guard a three point shooter, and a lot of first and second round SEC tournament exits.
I know Grant's teams have been hard to watch. I also know that what Alabama does on the offensive end of the court hardly resembles basketball. But please don't allow your despair to turn Gottfried's tenure into something it wasn't. He had some great players and we had some exciting times but he was not a great coach by any stretch of the imagination. He was here two years too long.
Grant has some work to do. I have said it before and I will say it again. He needs to get himself a recruiting coordinator and offensive coordinator on his staff. He needs to engage the fanbase and generate some excitement for his program. He must realize that at Alabama winning ugly means that you will play in front of 5,000 fans in Coleman. No win will enjoy the wins and they won't be able to tolerate the losses. His current personnel plays better when they push the tempo. If I were him, I would tell my guys to push the pace more and avoid half court ball at all costs until we get a quality big man. Playing at a faster pace will generate excitement and it will also help mask Alabama's obvious deficiencies.
Also, we don't have enough money in the world to get Few or Stevens. They play in front of sold out crowds every home game. We are stuck with Grant for at least a couple more years. Hopefully if we get this thing going. Right now, it doesn't look good but I have still have some hope. Sorry about the long post.
Honestly, I think people will and did show up when we won ugly the last 2 years. People don't show up this year because of December and the fact that any being honest with themselves knew our NCAA hopes were done. People won't show up to watch an NIT team play ugly. People did show up the last 2 years for sec games and we had solid crowds.
These are my fav. types of posts, next year will be better because of Taylor and Hale! But i thought we were supposed to be better this year because of better team chemistry and Pollard was a thousand times better than Tony Mitchell. Funny how that all seemed to work out. Grant's style is the exact same style since he got here, good defense followed by fits of utter insconsistency and an anemic offense. We were anemic with TM and Green at times as well, and they were 3 times the post and wing players we have now. Cooper and Lacey are scoring more, but that is merely because of more minutes, not because they have fundamentally improved. Releford has had a better year shooting, but for a PG he is a bad distributor and his assist numbers prove it. Taylor is a good defensive prescence coming in, but he has major issues at the post, and is prone to being pushed around. Think Pollard except taller. Hale is a nice skill player, but not a banger for the low post. Gueye and Carl will have one more year, but they are consistently injured and unreliable. Steele will be gone, and Retin while athletic is not a great backup yet. We probably will be around the same win total next year, as the league will still be god awful.
Grant will still not be a positive for selling our program to fans and recruits, and honestly it's really hard for me to believe that kids want to come to a program where offense is considered a bad word. I would love to get Pearl if it was possible, as his show cause would be up, and he brings more excitement in one day to a program than Grant has brought in 4 yrs. Also I think that next year you will see a big time jump from USC, ARK and Vandy back to respectability.
You never heard me say that we would be better. I said that Alabama should have a chance to win the SEC and get in the tournament because the conference is horrible. Alabama was going to be competitive essentially by default.
Taylor is not like Pollard at all. They don't even compare. I have seen him play. So, no, don't think Pollard except taller when you see Taylor. Taylor can not put the ball on the floor. Pollard is a three while Taylor is a post guy. Pollard has no business guarding guys in the post. He is doing so now because Grant doesn't have a choice.
Hale will offer something that none of our post guys have now, a jumper. That alone helps tremendously.
Releford numbers have gone down because he has less help. He has to shoot more because Alabama does not have a Mitchell or Green on the team anymore. Green could shoot a short jumper while Mitchell could slash, penetrate and finish at the rim. Those type of players help a point guard be more productive. Without them, Releford's assists go down.
Although I like Pearl and think he is a pretty good coach, he is not an option at Alabama. Mal nor the board of Trustees will hire a guy like him. He is a scumbucket with a severely checkered past.
Look, I can tell that you are not a Grant fan. That's fine. You don't have to be to support the program. However, he is not going anywhere anytime soon. In my opinion, Alabama will be a better team next year because of overall depth. You don't have to agree. The great thing about it is, god willing, we will be able to find out who is right. We both hope that Alabama is better because we obviously pull for the same team. I can tell that you are passionate about Alabama basketball. I appreciate that. Lets hope that Grant can pull it together. If not, lets hope that we can get him the hell out of here and not hold on too long like we did with Gottfried.
Good points made by some of the Grant supporters in this thread. If we truly can't get anyone better than Grant, and that fact kind of scares me, than I guess we are pretty much stuck regardless. Hopefully we will be able to field a basketball team in 2 years with the sluggish way he recruits. Having 5 scholarship players may be a bridge too far.
Again, I love Bama basketball and I want the best for the program. If Grant is the best we can do, then there is nothing anyone can do but accept it. We have no choice but to be okay with scoring in the 30s against a terrible Auburn team in a loss and blowing a freaking 10 point lead with 4:30 left against a poor LSU team. As a perfectionist and athlete myself (not in college), it is annoying as heck.
I never said Taylor was a 3. I said he was like Pollard. He's ultra athletic and bouncy. However he is not a skilled off. post, and only has one post move. His speciality is defense. I just get tired of the posts of wait to next year. Last time I checked we have waited for 4 years. This isn't football. It doesn't take 4 full recruiting classes to turn a team around. Also, I don't know why you think we have a shot next year to win the SEC. UK, UF, Missouri, and Arkansas all had better recruiting classes than we did. Despite are inflated record we aren't the second best team in the league. We are the only team in the league that doesn't have to play one of the other top 5 teams in the SEC twice this year, and we also benefitted from getting to play the two worst teams twice. We lucked out not having to play UF, UK, Missouri, ole miss, and Arkansas twice. We have only beaten one top 50 team all year, and if we don't beat UF then we will have gone 2 years in a row of not beating one top 25 team in the country. If we had shown improvement in some areas of our game over 4 years I would feel better, but we are the same team he started with 4 years ago. Good defense with pitiful offense and bad losses in non conference to inferior teams.
So knocking Grant isn't good enough for you. You have to single out each player and tell the world how they aren't good enough for you either? I'm guessing your a glass is 100% empty type of person.
I didn't expect this year to be great. I could see it clearly being a rebuilding year considering we were losing two All-SEC caliber upperclassmen. Green going into the season was actually ranked the #5 player in the nation by one pub. When people asked me about Alabama before the season, I said we might make the tournament and we were a likely bubble team.
I think Taylor has a ton of potential. His coach has recently said that he has really worked on the offensive side of the ball and he is making progress. You can't each the reach that he has. He can be a big time player and could be a rebounding/defensive presence in his first season.
A big jump from USC? You mean they might not finish last in the league? I'm here in Columbia. I have a lot of respect for Martin, but that team is completely devoid of talent. I don't think Bruce will play next season either. They are still two years away from being a successful team. But then again he is looking at a lot of turnover two year from now too. So they may continue to struggle. And USC would be dumb as $h!t to get rid of Martin. He just needs time to establish the program AND IT MAY TAKE MORE THAN FOUR YEARS.
You make way to much sense for a lot of people.
This is a message board, and why is analyzing our players and critiquing what they do a bad thing? Do you think writers around the country don't do the same thing?
Ok, how about this critique, since his first season, Alabama has statistically gotten worse on offense every season under Grant. In year 4 we are averaging our lowest PPG and our lowest FG percentage and APG in all 4 years of Grant. That's with the help of a 3 OT game. We improved last year on our 3 pt percentage, which was horrible. The team Grant took over averaged 73 ppg a game. In his 1st year as coach they averaged 69 ppg. Now it's 64 ppg against the worst the league has seen in 25 years or more.
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