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How about the rumors of Gottfried and Ron's girlfriend? Was there truth to that or not? Since you are friends with Ron, then no doubt you can answer this one and put it to rest. TIA
Yeah playing 40 minutes is horrible. I mean my god imagine if people had to play that many minutes for say like 82 games. Also you seem to not even take one point and disprove it. Not one person in the entire medical staff could find a injury. That isn't made up that is fact. What is a coach supposed to say when the best surgeon says he is ok. Also Gottfried didn't make Ron play. He didn't hold a gun to his head. Ron never told any of the medical staff that he couldn't play. He sad he had pain but that they couldn't find it and trust me some of the best minds were working to find it. Blaming it on a coach for playing a kid is a joke. Guess what Ron has bad knees if it's hurting him then quit. He wanted to play, the medical staff cleared him, so a coach puts him on the floor. It is not a coaches job to judge a players medical condition. It's the trainers and doctors. Yet we never see anyone blame them. Think about that for a second.
Ivory tusk: no flame but why do you support CMG so much?
Actually found out new info tonight. Turns out coach knew Ron was injured. Ron told the medical staff he couldn't play. But an evil coach told the medical staff to shut up or they will get fired. He even told dr. Andrews to fudge the examination so he could get away with it. Yeah that is what must have happened.
Fact is not one medical staff in the country, especially one that has dr. Andrews consulting on the case would allow a kid to play if they thought he was being injured by it. If that were true then the medical staff would be fired, but I haven't heard you once bash them. But the guy with no medical experience, yeah he is the one to blame.
I don't support him I hate people attacking and acting like he caused Ron harm when every single person on the medical staff cleared him. Coaches have to rely on a medical staff, it's not their job to judge medical issues as well it shouldn't be. I will attack arguments that are flawed logically if they don't make sense. What's wrong in actually stating facts. If Ron was mistreated medically then he would had a case against UA but even Steeles family felt so confident in that medical staff that they allowed their other son to play for them. The same people that cleared Ron sit on CAG's bench and they would never allow a kid harm, or allow a coach to harm a kid by playing him. They all missed the diagnosis because it was extremely tough. Even Dr. Andrews missed it.
I'm not referring to the medical issue. I'm asking about you defending him on his performance overall and in particular his last 3 seasons at Bama.
Actually if you go back and look at my posts I said he deserved to get fired for his last few seasons. However I don't like people coming up with illogical statements about it. I will defend part of his performance because we did have good seasons under him, but if you point that out you get attacked on here. I find that some people on here seem to only remember the bad things people do, and never the good. I also find it funny that so many think he wouldn't win again. Coaches grow and learn in this profession, by nature you get better over time. Grant has had his shortcomings in areas, but trust me he is learning and growing as well. He is a former Bama player and Coach. We never had a NCAA violation under him, he graduated his players, and we had success at times. He wasn't able to sustain that success and had other problems like road wins and loss of fan support that led to his firing, and it was deserved. But I don't hate a person for lack of success. Coach Moody was our greatest woman's coach ever, but his last 5 years he was horrible and was fired because of it. So should I now hate him for it? I don't hate former coaches just because we lose, and I don't care about their off court personal issues because I feel that a person has a right to their private life and I have no basis to judge someone. I like CAG and feel we are turning in the right direction, but that doesn't mean that I can't cheer for a former coach to change and grow as a coach and to be successful. I cheer for Shula too and hope him the best as well.
Mark disgraced himself and embarrassed (at the least) his alma mater/employer. He was so distracted by his off the court distractions that he did a poor job and let the program slide . He was fired, which was both logical and proper. I really could not care less about his success or lack thereof at NCSt and am astounded that the topic is of so much interest to Bama fans.
Hit the nail on the head. We have a passionate fan base and I don't mind the anger aimed at people who really stabbed our program in the back. People are going to go after Gottfried on off the court issues because he is back to having success on the court. But don't think for a minute that they wouldn't be on here looking for something else if those rumors weren't out there. Shula was a model citizen and people on this board hate him. why? Because he didn't win titles and we had some tough years under him. He wasn't ready for this job but it doesn't mean we should hate him. The guy did his best. Gottfried is a very good basketball coach who lost his way for a few years. He has bounced back and I think it's great. I wish him nothing but the best.
You did say he deserves to be fired yet you turn right back and try to make excuses for him (coaching is hard, these are 18-21 year old kids he is dealing with, etc).
I asked why are you defending him and you said you are not defending him. But when myself and others try to place blame on him you made an argument trying to deflect the blame away from him. To me and others on this board that comes off as trying to defend him.
So I feel CMG screwed the pooch his last 3 years and when it was apparent the ship was sinking it didn't seem as though he was busting his ass to try and save the ship. This is where the lazy/complaisant perception comes into play.
This post was edited by GSay001 2 years ago
So I have one question, you ask why I defend an argument. Here is my question, why do people get upset if I have a differing opinion and post? But people who post attacking and hating him can post all they want and you don't seem to have a problem with that. How many people have you gotten unto on the message board for starting Mark Gottfried rants. You can go back through all of my 373 posts and I have never once started a thread on the subject at all. I post when I see illogical posts, and I have never made excuses for him, I have stated facts about the profession. I have always stated facts about his record, his offense and his defense. I have always stated facts about his road record, and his successes and failures. Why is it alright to always post rants about hating him, but it's not alright for a person to post and say to him good luck?
This post was edited by IvoryTusk 2 years ago
We had a good season under Fran and he stopped the UT streak as well as pound Auburn.
Still don't like him.
Hahah! Theta at least your consistent!
Just answer the question and quit getting so defensive about it.
Btw I'm not attacking you, just asking a question. The only reason I ask is because seem to be so passionate about it.
Also I didn't ask why you are defending an argument I asked why you are defending CMG.
Because I don't feel the lazy argument is true, and it's inherently illogical. Lazy implies that he stopped going to practice, showed up to work late, didn't show up at meetings, etc. I feel that there are thousands of small factors that lead to success and failure, and just saying he was lazy doesn't make sense. Most people who get to Million dollar salaries in life are generally not lazy.
I have always felt that people never look at factors that do affect teams. It's not lazy if you still have the same gameplan, and have the same practice plan, but it is a bad coaching decision if you evaluate assistant coaches and make bad hires. There were 2-3 assistant hires that were very poor that led to problems on the staff. Notable Eugene Harris, etc. I don't attribute that to being lazy just being a poor evaluator of coaching talent at that time. Same thing can be said for recruiting misses. I think the one recruit in the end that was extremely overvalued was Pickett. We had several major misses at the PG position that led to problems on the team, and I also felt that he did not correctly evaluate Torrance as he pushed him more as a SG and should have had him at PG all the time (Note he later corrected that mistake in a situation at NCSU were he correctly moved Lorenzo Brown to PG from SG starting this year). We also had several injury factors that played into that 3 year span as well. Losing Chuck Davis was huge, but also Steele's knee injuries directly led to many losses after the NCAA tourney run. I think he also had evaluated some guys as leaders who turned out to not be suited for the role and this effected the team as well.
I could go on and on, but I get passionate because I don't like people saying he was lazy or complacent because it really paints a poor picture of what can happen to a team and what factors lead to winning or losing. Painting in broad strokes is never good in my mind, so if I see a general statement I attack it, unless it's backed up with facts and takes a look at lots of factors.
Dude, he's a CMG fan.
Hell, I was too until I heard a story one day at a friend's house. Haven't liked him since
Okay I hear ya on that.
Lazy does not imply that he wasn't going to meetings, late, etc. negligence would imply that. Also I don't think we are saying he is lazy just that he had a period where he didn't put in 100%, call it lazy, lack of effort or whatever. I also think the reasons you stated are all valid and contribute. However, Saban has missed on recruits and made poor assistant coaching hires yet his consistent effort and focus on discipline have carried him through.
In the end I don't think there is a black and white answer here. You clearly follow the basketball program and I was just asking why you don't support the "lazy" theory which you have now clearly laid out.
Roll Tide bro!
In football it's much easier to cover a bad hire with so many people on staff. In basketball one or two bad hires can be a death of a program in certain areas. Roll Tide as well and hope you are watching one of the ugliest games ever in Cincinnati and FSU.
Ehh, nope. Being forced to watch desperate housewives on TiVo. Please stab me
Now I know why you were posting so much.. If you watch that for to long you stab your own eyes out!
I agree with everything but would add that just because CMG has NCSU in the sweet sixteen doesn't mean a mistake was made when we fired him. The program had slipped terribly under him despite an elite 8 run in 2004. He inherited a lot of talent at NCSU. that team can play with anyone athletically and I knew they were going to make a run when I saw them on the floor with UNC in the ACC tourny. Having said that I think the question is why are they having to make this run as an 11 seed. That team should not be an 11.
Our team was lucky ot get a 9 seed. We aren't that talented.
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