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  • Bearyant said... (original post)

    We as Bama fans seem to hae very low standards when it comes to OC. People seem very willing to settle for someone with no proven record whatsoever. I don't think people realize that we are the KING of college football right now. We have a huge stadium, NFL talent, rabid fanbase, Saban as coach, on the verge of another NC, and we pay coaches huge salaries.
    We do not have to settle for just anyone. We can demand a PROVEN OC who has been successful. There is no way someone without a successful track record should even get a sniff at this job.

    This is a critical hire because with Saban, we are never going to have any worries on the defensive side of the ball. Its always going to be the offense that is the question mark. We need real leadership and critical thinking there. Besides, the better the offense is, it makes the defenses job (and stats) that much better.

    Lol. You are going to "demand" something? Who exactly are you going to send this "demand" to? Newsflash but you have absolutely zero influence on this hire. Don't think CNS or CMM are paying any attention to any of your thoughts.
    cNSs job is to run this program the way he sees fit in concert with his overall system and program. So if that means he promotes groh or Napier ...or hell, if he wants to let rob ezell call the plays that's what will happen.
    But good luck with your "demands".

  • Bearyant -

    was Joe Pendry a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama? was Gene Stallings a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama?

    any OC works with what he has. look at Malzahn. all world last year and look at how aubbie struggled this year. the talent level available and the system employed means a lot.

    if Coach Saban chooses to go with Groh, that means to me Groh is an excellent choice for the job. Coach Saban has seen him work up close and personal, and that means 100 times more than what Groh's record may have been at Virginia.

  • bamabyrd08 said... (original post)

    Besides his name why? he's never been a play caller and he was a defensive assistant with atlanta before coming to NO. Brees has been great under his name but Brees is one of the smartest QBs in the league. When Payton went down the play calling duties went to Pete Carmichael who's been with Brees since SD. If anyone on the staff it would be him as my choice.

    Here is what I previously wrote about Lombardi explaining why I thought he would be a great hire. Yes Carmichael would also be a great choice, but he isn't leaving the NFL, he will be a HC soon.

    This would be my top choice for OC. He is young(39), energetic, and from what I have been told, has an amazing work ethic. His experience clearly demonstrates a complete understanding of the game, not just one side of the ball. I think he would be a great addition to Coach Saban's staff. He has both pro and college experience as well as serving as a recruiting coordinator.

    Another little tidbit. Actually in Lombardi's first year as QB coach in 2009 when they won the Super Bowl, they ran the ball 468 times and threw it 514. A big improvement over the previous years. That is pretty balanced. Sean Payton has routinely given Lombardi praise for stressing that the Saints need to run more and be more balanced.

    Carmichael the Saints official OC doesn't usually call plays when Peyton is healthy...just sayin'!

    The only question is whether Lombardi would come to college. He is a rising star in the NFL and is probably on the way to becoming an OC in the NFL. He clearly has the lineage to get a shot at a HC gig in the NFL, if he wants it. However, I think he would be a great college coach, bring a lot to the program, and have the opportunity to be a big time college HC or go back to the NFL should he desire.

    Here is his bio from the Saints website:

    Joe Lombardi enters his fifth season with the Saints and third as quarterbacks coach after having served as an offensive assistant the first two years.

    Last season under Lombardi’s guidance, Drew Brees was selected to his fifth Pro Bowl and became only the second NFL passer to have five straight seasons with 4,000 yards after finishing with 4,620 passing yards, second only to his 5,069 yard total in 2008. Brees also finished with 33 touchdowns passes for his fourth consecutive season of 30 or more touchdowns.

    In Lombardi’s first season as quarterbacks coach in 2009, Brees enjoyed a banner campaign, completing 363-of-514 passes for 4,388 yards with 34 touchdowns, setting new career-highs with an NFL record 70.6 completion percentage and a league-leading 109.6 passer rating.

    In his previous position, he was heavily involved in the preparation of the quarterbacks and passing attack as well, having worked closely with offensive coordinator Pete Carmichael Jr. Lombardi also stepped in for a brief stint as the running backs coach near the end of 2008.

    He arrived in New Orleans with extensive coaching experience on both sides of the ball, most recently serving as defensive assistant for the Atlanta Falcons in 2006. While in that role, Lombardi worked with a defensive line that combined for 25.5 sacks.

    Bringing game-planning and play-calling experience to his position, he was the offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach from 2002-05 at Mercyhurst College, also serving as recruiting coordinator.

    Lombardi coached tight ends and running backs for the New York/New Jersey Hitmen of the XFL. In 2000, he tutored the defensive line and served as strength & conditioning coordinator at Bucknell University.

    He coached both the tight ends and tackles at the Virginia Military Institute in 1999, and Lombardi opened his coaching career at the University of Dayton, where he was responsible for the defensive line from 1996-98. The Flyers won 20-straight games during his tenure.

    Lombardi – the grandson of legendary coach Vince Lombardi – is a 1994 graduate of the United States Air Force Academy, where he earned three letters as a tight end and one in lacrosse. Lombardi and his wife, Molly, have five children: sons Joseph, Thomas and Dominic and daughters Maria and Bernadette.

    Here is Carmichael's bio:

    Pete Carmichael Jr. is in his third season as the Saints’ offensive coordinator after tutoring the club’s quarterbacks the previous three years. Throughout this time he has been a key figure in the planning and preparations of an offensive attack that has been ranked first in the NFL in yardage in three of the last five seasons, while leading the league in scoring for the 2008 and 2009 campaigns.

    In 2010, the Saints finished third in the NFC and sixth in the NFL after averaging 372.5 yards of total offense, while finishing third in the league in passing, averaging 277.6 net yards per game through the air. The unit converted a club record 48.8% of their third down conversions and finished second in the conference and fifth in the league with 351 first downs, the second-most in club record books.

    In his first season with his new title, The Saints continued to compile impressive numbers on offense. The Saints finished in the top five in seven offensive categories and eight single season and single game team records were set or tied. They scored a club-record and NFL-best 510 points, the ninth-highest total in league record books. At least 45 points were scored four times, a fifth time in the postseason, with four straight outputs of at least 30. They ranked first in the league with 6,461 net yards, the second-best total in club history. The Saints’ 348 first downs was the second-best total both in 2009 league rankings and in team record books. The Saints also finished ranked sixth in the NFL in rushing yardage with 131.6 yards per game on a club-best 4.5 yards per carry, an improvement from 28th in 2008 and their highest ranking since 1987 when they were third with a 146.0 average.

    The offense continued to flourish in the postseason, averaging 35.6 points per game and scoring eight-of-nine times inside the red zone. QB Drew Brees keyed the run, completing 70.6 percent of his passes and throwing eight touchdowns, tied for the fifth-highest postseason total in NFL history and a 117.0 passer rating. He was selected MVP in Super Bowl XLIV, as he led the Saints back from a ten point deficit, completing 18 of his last 19 passes and engineering the fourth quarter game-winning drive, culminating in the go-ahead touchdown pass with under five minutes left.

    In 2008, Carmichael’s title was quarterbacks/passing game – with duties that included assisting in the pass routes, protection schemes and quarterback responsibilities. He tutored the signal callers his first three seasons with the club. In 2008, the offense went on to rank No. 1 in the NFL in passing, and Brees threw for 5,069 yards – the second-highest total in league history and tossed a club-record 34 touchdowns.

    Carmichael has worked closely with Brees since both arrived in New Orleans in 2006, and since then the majority of the franchise’s career, single-game and single-season passing records have fallen. Brees has led the NFL in passing yardage twice, set the NFL record for completion percentage (70.6-2009) and has thrown for a club record 155 touchdowns over the last five seasons.

    Carmichael brings the perspective of having a wide range of coaching experiences, including working with nearly every position group on offense during his career. With the Chargers, he assisted wide receivers coach James Lofton for an offense that ranked 10th in the NFL in 2004 and 2005. Carmichael joined the Chargers in 2002 and served as offensive assistant/quality control until being promoted.

    In 2001, Carmichael was quality control coach for the Washington Redskins, and in 2000, he was the tight ends and offensive assistant coach for the Cleveland Browns. From 1995-99, Carmichael was the quarterbacks coach at Louisiana Tech, and during his tenure the Bulldogs’ QBs broke almost every passing record at the school. He began his coaching career as the assistant offensive line coach at the University of New Hampshire in 1994, with the Wildcats winning the Yankee Conference championship.

    Born Oct. 6, 1971 in Framingham, Mass., Carmichael attended Medway (Mass.) HS where he played football and baseball. He went on to a collegiate playing career in baseball and was a four-year letterman at Boston College. As a senior, Carmichael was a team captain and Most Valuable Player. He graduated with a degree in mathematics in 1994.

    Carmichael and his wife, Tina, have sons, Peter and John and a daughter Allison.

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  • agree 1000 percent,we gotta get somebody that knows some stuff,if were goin 2 b able 2 recruit elite people on off.we gotta get more explosive .

  • Hmmm who should I base my
    Judgements of Groh on? The fan base who says no way and we are Alabama and should hit a homerun, or Nick Saban who works with Groh every single day? Seriously people look at Groh as a complete miss, but last time I checked Saban hand selected this guy to be WR coach after he came here as a GA to learn under Mcelwain and Saban. If Saban wants him, then that is good enough for me. Saban wasn't wrong on young assistants Kirby Smart or Jeremy Pruitt when he promoted them, its called development!

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  • IvoryTusk said... (original post)

    Hmmm who should I base my
    Judgements of Groh on? The fan base who says no way and we are Alabama and should hit a homerun, or Nick Saban who works with Groh every single day? Seriously people look at Groh as a complete miss, but last time I checked Saban hand selected this guy to be WR coach after he came here as a GA to learn under Mcelwain and Saban. If Saban wants him, then that is good enough for me. Saban wasn't wrong on young assistants Kirby Smart or Jeremy Pruitt when he promoted them, its called development!

    ^^^This. When Saban promoted Pruitt there was a meltdown about his ability to recruit Mobile. We see how that has worked out.

  • BamaLefty...your too dumb to answer
    Crimson71.....good point but considering offense is Saban weakness, i hope he gets someone who can help him in this area. When Saban's team can rely on the defense to carry the team. He usually does pretty good......When the offense has to carry most of the load on Saban's teams, he is usually not as successful. Someones record speaks volumes. But of course he can hire who he wants.

  • Crimson71 said... (original post)

    Bearyant -

    was Joe Pendry a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama? was Gene Stallings a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama?

    any OC works with what he has. look at Malzahn. all world last year and look at how aubbie struggled this year. the talent level available and the system employed means a lot.

    if Coach Saban chooses to go with Groh, that means to me Groh is an excellent choice for the job. Coach Saban has seen him work up close and personal, and that means 100 times more than what Groh's record may have been at Virginia.

    I'm not looking for a home run hire because I don't want to be in Florida's position now. Wies left them high and dry. Auburn does this with their coaches. They look to see who is the latest "can't miss" name out there and throw a ton of money at him. However, there are more factors that are considered other than just a name. Personality, fit, recruiting, work ethic all have to align with Saban's overall philosophy. I imagine that can be tough for some coaches.

    But, Bearyant's isn't "demanding" anything...that was a silly response. He is saying that Alabama under Saban is in the top 3 defenses in the nation. We don't have to worry about our defense because they will show up every week. We haven't reached that elite level from our offense. We've had some good offenses under Mac, but not elite. I would hope our offensive goal is to be a better unit every year which this has occurred under Saban.

    Bama, as a program, is in a position where we can be extremely picky with what coaches to bring in. It's a great paying, high profile job that looks great when trying to get a head coaching position. Bearyant is saying we shouldn't have to settle and I agree with him. There's a lot of defensive minded posters on this board that have watched 3 yards and a cloud of dust offense for as long as they can remember at Bama and that's how they feel the offense should always be. That's fine. But, fresh faces and fresh ideas can be a great addition from time to time. We can be a physical, dominating offense will scoring TD's in the redzone instead of field goals. It may seem weird at first. But, it is legal. :) This is probably going to be one of the biggest hires Saban has had since he has been at Bama. I'm glad they are taking their time and not rushing things.

  • Bearyant said... (original post)

    BamaLefty...your too dumb to answer
    Crimson71.....good point but considering offense is Saban weakness, i hope he gets someone who can help him in this area. When Saban's team can rely on the defense to carry the team. He usually does pretty good......When the offense has to carry most of the load on Saban's teams, he is usually not as successful. Someones record speaks volumes. But of course he can hire who he wants.

    Try me genius. I may surprise you....btw. "your" when you are accusing me as being dumb? Nice

    But in the effort of keeping this civil during Christmas, I will say that a groh promotion to OC doesn't excite me a ton, and I have kept up with UVa football for awhile. But considering that CNS has taken us to 2 BCS games in 3 years, I will give him the benefit of the doubt. Plus, I also concede that whether it's perception or reality CNSs options may be more limited than you want to admit due to his perceived chokehold on offensive creativity and play calling.
    Seriously though, you really think the word "demand" is appropriate? Come on....

  • cmbama said... (original post)

    ^^^This. When Saban promoted Pruitt there was a meltdown about his ability to recruit Mobile. We see how that has worked out.

    OC is different from DB coach. OC is the leader of the entire offensive side of the ball. Behind Saban of course, he sets the tone for everthing on that side of the ball. A position coach is little different. You can afford to give someone who may be borderline a try. Besides that Saban is back there with Pruitt everyday to over-see what is going on......The offense is where Saban need a true leader to be able to handle things on his own because that is Saban only weakness as a coach.

  • Crimson71 said... (original post)

    Bearyant -

    was Joe Pendry a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama? was Gene Stallings a bad hire, he had a losing record before coming to bama?

    any OC works with what he has. look at Malzahn. all world last year and look at how aubbie struggled this year. the talent level available and the system employed means a lot.

    if Coach Saban chooses to go with Groh, that means to me Groh is an excellent choice for the job. Coach Saban has seen him work up close and personal, and that means 100 times more than what Groh's record may have been at Virginia.

    Yes. The fans have a horrible track record so personally I don't give a rat's ass what anybody on here thinks. Applewhite was a home run on here and Pendry caused a meltdown. That should tell you enough. We would have been beside ourselves with excitement last year over a hire like fat Weiss. We are beyond ignorant. None of us have a freaking clue of what's actually going on with interpersonal dynamics, other leadership, ect.

    We could be watching like Auburn just trying to open up the cash register to the hot name of the week to get some nice press for a month but we are not. Thats a good thing. Saban can do whatever he wants if he wanted a $1 million coach he could have it without a single objection but he will make that decision carefully considering the ego factor and how dynamics will work with what we have currently built that's so very successful.

    If it turns out to be Groh then great, I think Saban knows what he doing.

  • Bearyant said... (original post)

    OC is different from DB coach. OC is the leader of the entire offensive side of the ball. Behind Saban of course, he sets the tone for everthing on that side of the ball. A position coach is little different. You can afford to give someone who may be borderline a try. Besides that Saban is back there with Pruitt everyday to over-see what is going on......The offense is where Saban need a true leader to be able to handle things on his own because that is Saban only weakness as a coach.

    Haha. The offense is not a weakness of Saban. He has had a top three offense in the SEC pretty much every year in the ten years he has coached in the SEC excluding his first year with a new program. You are being ridiculous.

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    !!!

  • BattlestarTide said... (original post)

    I think Groh is our BATNA option. Those that have done professional negotiations know what I'm talking about. If we can't find our #1 guy (or #2 or #3 or #4) and we suddenly find ourselves in March and all of our candidates rejecting us, then Groh will be given the headset. Again, no direct inside information, just what it sounds like. If Groh was going to be promoted he would've been announced as such already. As for his UVA experience, if he was never the head coach's son he would've have been an offensive coordinator, but besides I think some people learn best from their failures and it's not like UVA had 5-star athletes lining up at the door to play there.

    If Groh does get promoted, does this mean Cris Carter is now on the inside track for becoming our WR coach?

    This might be what happens. What high school wide receiver would not want to come and play for Chris Carter as his position coach?

  • I don't know who the new OC will be but I do think there's a chance it could be Groh. I imagine he's a relentless worker as proven by the opportuities he's been given by Coach. I'm certain he's champing at the bit to prove everyone wrong regarding the reason UVA wasn't successful while he was OC. He came here so he could build his resume back up and progress his career. He's hungry and that's something everyone here should consider. While I wish his prior resume looked better, I don't think he should be cast aside because of it. Personally, I think he could be great if given the job.

  • can u have volunteer coaches? not talking about grad assistants. carter would take a pay cut and his son will probably only be at bama one year, two tops. if you can volunteer and coach, it would be great for Carter to come in for spring practice and fall camp, but I do not think him being a full time coach is very realistic.

  • Crimson71 said... (original post)

    can u have volunteer coaches? not talking about grad assistants. carter would take a pay cut and his son will probably only be at bama one year, two tops. if you can volunteer and coach, it would be great for Carter to come in for spring practice and fall camp, but I do not think him being a full time coach is very realistic.

    Also doubt it. I just don't see Saban doing that.

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