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I know they're the premier doormat in this conference over the course of many years, but they have had some decent teams in recent years. Nothing great, but decent. I think they have a very smart coach now, and you ask any coach that's been successful over time, and they'll tell you that you have to sell what you have rather than what someone else doesn't. Vandy can sell academics, playing time, and the SEC. That's not a bad start. The problem in a place like that is sustainability. In their perfect 20 year scenario, just how good could they be? Apples and Oranges, I know, but Miami was horrendous before Schnellenberger. I don't think they'll ever be the U, but with new conference expansion, what are the chances Mizzou, KY, and the MIss schools are their doormat in a few years?
Frankly, I like their coach and I like their school. I do hate their basketball program with the searing flames of 7 suns, but beyond that, I have no beef with them. Just wondered if anyone else thinks they have South Carolina type potential. I think I do.
Their D used to put some fear in folks. I'd like to see them get back to form and shake up the East a bit, maybe even embarass the division by winning it occasionally.
"[Desert Tider is] not appropriate at all, but everyone wasn't raised well." --BamaJan
they'll be switching places with Auburn and Ole Siss to head back up the conference rankings, while those two (Auburn and Ole Siss) will be headed back to the bottom instead, where they belong...
1960 Les Paul
I think they could get to the USCe level. It will take a few years if it happens though. They'll win 7 games next year, 8 or 9 if they could pull an upset and a bowl win.
I think that under the best scenario, they could be a middle of the pack East team, and win it (the East) on rare occasion. Winning the SEC would require a perfect storm, including Saban retiring.
And I'm a Vandy homer, FWIW.
Last year Franklin did the best coaching job in the conference for guys not named Saban. He is going to make them solid over time and an 8 or 9 win year isn't a stretch really. They were real close to catching UGA and UT. Vandy won't be a sneezer next year. They are quietly beating UT in state. The only limitation for them is they have higher academic standards.
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They aint hit the ceiling yet, but they are ducking walking in the door.
Look at Georgia Tech and I think that's the mold Vandy fits in.
Another thing vandy can sell is the city itself. Nashville is very nice and has a great atmosphere along with great tradition. The only thing that hurts vandy is the recruits in the state of Tennessee. Not that many great ones and they will have a hard tine getting those 4* guys out of Alabama and ga respectively. Sure they may get a couple but they will have to bring in a 9 win season before recruits start to really take notice in what is going in up there. They can change the overall look of the sec and its on the verge of happening with just a pretty good season.
8 win team in a great year. They will not hit USCe levels. That's back to back seasons of 10 and 11 wins plus a sec east title. Not happening.
If they resided in a state that produced more D1 talent, they might have a chance. But they will always top out at 5-6 wins. 7 if everything falls their way.
I actually see a higher ceiling. Before you call the psychiatrist for me let me give my reasoning. Compare them to Stanford with not a whole lot of regional recruiting success (tennessee doesn't produce a ton of D1 talent) Tennesse is down as well. Stanford isn't a tier 1 school but they are in a weaker conference, sale academics and offer what seems like 400 kids a year in order to get 2-3 big ones and occasionally a Lucky one (pun intended).
The question is if Vandy will ever have the national recruiting success Stanford does. That's how Stanford competes: they sell the prestige of the institution to athletes everywhere. If they were restricted to fighting with USC and Oregon for instate prospects, they would still be a doormat. Yes, there are guys like Rodgers (who coincidentally is from Cali) but take a look at the 2012 recruiting class:
Tennessee - 6
Georgia - 5
Florida - 4
Alabama - 3
Maryland - 1
Mississippi - 1
Texas - 1
Virginia - 1
What do all these have in common? They haven't even been able to recruit the Carolinas, Arkansas, or Louisiana. If Vandy is a hard sell for someone one state over, it's going to be tough to get a guy to come from across the country. Not that it doesn't happen (again, Rodgers), but not as much as they need it to in order to achieve what Stanford has. Maybe that will come with time, maybe not. If they can do that, Vandy is going to look like a very different team in a few years. Otherwise..hey, some schools (like that one over at the western end of Vandy's own state) would kill to make a bowl game.
I hear you Mattzilla, but I think that may be the only thing that would keep them from USCe quality...that and any coach that wins 8-9 games in consecutive seasons is probably going to leave them. You never know, though. They may catch lightning and get that coach that just wants to be there long term...Franklin, IMO, is a star in the making.
Consistency is the thing that keeps my prognosis in check. I believe they have the potential to get to that 10 win season, but they need major depth to do it repeatedly, which will be difficult.
On the other side of the coin, they're in a place, both geographically and by conference alignment, to pick up some players that the big boys overlooked. There's no debating the quality of football player in the south, nor the draw of the SEC. If I'm a kid with decent academic prowess that doesn't get offered by the big boys, Vandy seems much more attractive to me than Ole Miss, Kentucky, etc. And with my background (I'm not the only one), I'd rather go to Vandy than Auburn. You can obviously get to the league from there, and if injury ends your career, you get one hell of an education.
I'll crawfish a bit in the fact I don't ever see vandy reaching the level of stanford but the same blueprint could produce some of the same results in the future. Franklin ain't no dummy. My comments are purely speculative. The U, FSU and Oregon were once Homecoming invites.
great thread! I think the biggest thing...Is keeping Franklin and his staff for awhile...
Vandy has proven with Tim Corbin and their baseball program...that they will pay to keep a coach...
If they pay to keep Franklin...I can see him building a consistent 6-7 win team...maybe more...consistently going to bowls...
You guys are right about recruiting in TN...
However, the Atlanta area, and Georgia overall, and the state of Florida...put out tons of High School athletes...and with the 25 -scholarship limit, Bama and the other Powers can't sign them all...
will be interesting to watch...
If Vandy pays to keep Franklin around...and pays for him to bring in talented, hungry coaches...they can do some good things
I think they have already escaped the cellar and soundly passed Kentucky and Ole Miss in talent, and I think they could routinely challenge for 7-5, 8-4 type seasons IF Franklin continues to recruit successfully.
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You are correct, but I will have to agree with others and say that the fact that they are in Tennessee will prevent them from making a similar ascension. I think Shane has the right idea in that they could achieve 7-8 wins yearly with possibly a 9-10 win season thrown in there every 5-10 years.
Youre right about one thing...Its off the wall to think Vandy could be good at all. But I understand the question though..the perception that they could be slightly good is a valid one. I think in the east they are capable of being 4th best in the east. Never any better than that though IMO.
“Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, today is a gift of God, which is why we call it the present.”
Are you talking about the Woody days back in the mid to late 90's? I assume you were because he did lead Vandy to the #1 defense in the SEC in 1997 even with a record of 3-8 (0-8). Just comes to show you that Vandy was and still will be...well..Vandy (G). I'd like to see Vandy do better too, but I also know that its more than just a long shot that they will finish any better than 3rd at any point in the future.
Bottom line is they gotta win games when they've got the chance. They had Arky & UT both beat last year & found a way to lose the games. That is always what makes or brakes Vandy's seasons. Kinda like MSU in the West. MSU always loses a suck fest to AU early in the season. & that game shapes their whole season it seems.
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Agreed, every 4 to 5 years as a talented group of Sr's ( Tr&RS) come along they are very competitive, but they lack the ability to keep the pipe line full. Plus, I'm not sure about their facilities now, but they are going to have to continue to upgrade to decrease the gap between competitive seasons.
"BINGO! That was a goody!" - Coach Bryant on Sunday afternoons with Coca Cola & Golden Flakes
Vandy offered 3+MM to a guy that had never been a head coach last year in Malzhan. They have committed massive $$ to upgrading the facilities (including building an indoor practice facility). Make no mistake, Vandy has the ability to throw as much money at the football program as anyone in the SEC if they so chose. They have one of the largest endowments in the country. Thus, I think that YES, they will be willing to pay to keep Franklin and do what they need to do to compete. I don't think this will continue to be the Vandy that we used to know.
The lack of TN talent will hurt, but Franklin is already showing that he can go get some top talent elsewhere. Mommas everywhere love the pitch of a Vandy education.
I don't know if anyone has been paying attention, but a similar trend is going on at Harvard in their Baskball program - they have been getting top 100 talent lately with the same approach/pitch. They are dominating the Ivy league (duh), and will make some noise in March, and will get some guys drafted.
So I guess the underlying question here is, will Vanyd beat the barn this year?
They should but I'd suspect they will "find" a way to lose. While the barn gets some lucky break late in the game!
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